The Lords Tithe – Should A Christian Pay Tithes To The Church? – Part 2
December 8, 2008 by A Watchman
Click here to read The Lords Tithe part 1
Nehemiah 13:10-22
10And I perceived that the portions of the Levites had not been given them: for the Levites and the singers, that did the work, were fled every one to his field. 11Then contended I with the rulers, and said, Why is the house of God forsaken? And I gathered them together, and set them in their place. 12Then brought all Judah the tithe of the corn and the new wine and the oil unto the treasuries. 13And I made treasurers over the treasuries, Shelemiah the priest, and Zadok the scribe, and of the Levites, Pedaiah: and next to them was Hanan the son of Zaccur, the son of Mattaniah: for they were counted faithful, and their office was to distribute unto their brethren. 14Remember me, O my God, concerning this, and wipe not out my good deeds that I have done for the house of my God, and for the offices thereof.
15In those days saw I in Judah some treading wine presses on the sabbath, and bringing in sheaves, and lading asses; as also wine, grapes, and figs, and all manner of burdens, which they brought into Jerusalem on the sabbath day: and I testified against them in the day wherein they sold victuals. 16There dwelt men of Tyre also therein, which brought fish, and all manner of ware, and sold on the sabbath unto the children of Judah, and in Jerusalem. 17Then I contended with the nobles of Judah, and said unto them, What evil thing is this that ye do, and profane the sabbath day? 18Did not your fathers thus, and did not our God bring all this evil upon us, and upon this city? yet ye bring more wrath upon Israel by profaning the sabbath.
19And it came to pass, that when the gates of Jerusalem began to be dark before the sabbath, I commanded that the gates should be shut, and charged that they should not be opened till after the sabbath: and some of my servants set I at the gates, that there should no burden be brought in on the sabbath day. 20So the merchants and sellers of all kind of ware lodged without Jerusalem once or twice. 21Then I testified against them, and said unto them, Why lodge ye about the wall? if ye do so again, I will lay hands on you. From that time forth came they no more on the sabbath. 22And I commanded the Levites that they should cleanse themselves, and that they should come and keep the gates, to sanctify the sabbath day. Remember me, O my God, concerning this also, and spare me according to the greatness of thy mercy.
A man named Nehemiah looked at (took notice of, thought about) what was happening around him, and the scriptures say that he perceived (discerned) that things were not right. His intellect and reason told him that something was wrong. He saw that the Levites and the singers, that did the work in the house of God were out working in the field (the Levites had the tithe as their inheritance so that they wouldn’t have to work in the field, but could devote themselves wholy to God), the King James version of the bible says that they had fled there (infering that they were chased, or driven away), so he went to the rulers to contend (grapple, hold a controversy, defend) with them. I don’t know where the tithe was but when Nehemiah had set things right, the verse tells us “he set treasurers over the treasury“. Then he prays and says, “Lord, remember this one thing, that I have done”.
The previous scripture also says that Nehemiah saw that the people were profaning the Sabbath. In their greed they were working and buying and selling on the Sabbath day, a commanded cease from work, purposed as a day of joyful rest and recreation, in communion with YHVH. When he commanded that they no longer come into the city to buy and sell, they hung around outside the gates, no doubt looking for a way that they could continue to do business. In the end, Nehemiah had to threaten them with physical violence to make them desist from trading on the Lords‘ day.
John 2:12-16
12After this he went down to Capernaum, he, and his mother, and his brethren, and his disciples: and they continued there not many days. 13And the Jews’ passover was at hand, and Jesus went up to Jerusalem, 14And found in the temple those that sold oxen and sheep and doves, and the changers of money sitting: 15And when he had made a scourge of small cords, he drove them all out of the temple, and the sheep, and the oxen; and poured out the changers’ money, and overthrew the tables; 16And said unto them that sold doves, Take these things hence; make not my Father’s house an house of merchandise.
Nehemiah may have temporarily stopped those who were money hungry from profiteering on the Lords day, however, Yahu’shua, coming from Capernaum to Jerusalem for the Passover, perceived that the religious folk were up to their same old tricks again. The Jews were told that if their tithe was too much to carry on the journey that they could sell it before they left and upon arrival at Jerusalem they could buy “whatever their hearts desired”, so in actual fact, what they were doing was not wrong, and they could have felt completely justified in what they were doing. The problem was, that Gods temple is supposed to be a holy place, a place where men should go in awe of God to worship Him, not to buy and sell merchandise.
Today, the church is supposed to be a place of worship unto YHVH.
I want to tell you something. The world today sees the church as a house of merchandise and hypocrisy, rather than a house of worship. Many, many, many men and women have turned away from the church because of money hungry preachers.
It seems that a lot of church buildings you walk into today are into merchandising. I feel ashamed to sit in a church service while the promotion of books, tapes, CD’s, videos and t-shirts goes on around me. It almost seems that today’s ministerial success is measured by the amount of wealth the church can generate. In many Churches we hear a twenty minute message, three times a week, telling us that the Lord has commanded us to give ten percent of our income to the church.
They tell us that it will cost us ten percent of our income just to have God rebuke the devourer for our sakes, and that it is our extra offerings that will cause God to make us prosper.
Meanwhile they are building for themselves a kingdom.
The shameful part is … … … They do this in the name of God.
Some of the ministers teaching these things are ignorant (for want of a better word) of the scriptural methods and principles of tithing. Some have taken a doctrine handed down to them from other, more mature Christians without investigating its scriptural basis (their intentions may be pure), but some, as seen in the scriptures, are greedy men, eager to line their own pockets, they “come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves“ (Matthew 7:15).
Mark 11:11-20
11And Jesus entered into Jerusalem, and into the temple: and when he had looked round about upon all things, and now the eventide was come, he went out unto Bethany with the twelve. 12And on the morrow, when they were come from Bethany, he was hungry: 13And seeing a fig tree afar off having leaves, he came, if haply he might find any thing thereon: and when he came to it, he found nothing but leaves; for the time of figs was not yet. 14And Jesus answered and said unto it, No man eat fruit of thee hereafter for ever. And his disciples heard it. 15And they come to Jerusalem: and Jesus went into the temple, and began to cast out them that sold and bought in the temple, and overthrew the tables of the moneychangers, and the seats of them that sold doves; 16And would not suffer that any man should carry any vessel through the temple. 17And he taught, saying unto them, Is it not written, My house shall be called of all nations the house of prayer? but ye have made it a den of thieves. 18And the scribes and chief priests heard it, and sought how they might destroy him: for they feared him, because all the people was astonished at his doctrine. 19And when even was come, he went out of the city. 20And in the morning, as they passed by, they saw the fig tree dried up from the roots.
This time Yahu’shua rides into Jerusalem on a colt from Bethany. When He arrives in Jerusalem He heads straight for the temple of God. He stood inside the temple and looked around. They were back. It was evening, and nobody was there, but he perceived that they were back.
He turned and walked out of the Holy temple of God, went back to Bethany and slept.
In the morning he arose and headed back into Jerusalem with his disciples. From afar He saw a fig tree, in full foliage, and assuming that it bore fruit, being hungry, He approached it. The tree looked good from a distance, but upon inspection, it bore no fruit. There was nothing there to satisfy His hunger. Some translations say that Yahu’shua cursed the fig tree, and He commanded “No man eat fruit of thee hereafter for ever“.
I wonder if, as He spoke those words over that fig tree, He wasn’t thinking about the temple. I wonder if in His minds eye He saw men approach the temple of God, seeing from the outside its full glory, approaching it with a hunger for the reality of the things of God. But when they arrive there is no fruit to quench their hunger. The men there are hungry for money. They use the commandments of God, to their own advantage, to gain material wealth and status for themselves.
And Then … He turns His back and keeps on walking.
Now He approaches the temple.
He enters the doorway to the sanctuary of the Most High God. “They are here again, I told them once and they didn’t listen, this is beyond just merchandising, this is beyond ignorance, these people are full of greed and all kinds of evil. They have turned My house into a den of thieves”.
In a jealous rage of righteous anger for the house of God He upends their tables and chases them out yet again.
“Don’t you realize what you are doing???”
But these men don’t repent, like cowards; they run away and try to devise a plot to destroy Him.
The House of God has not changed much in 2000 years. It is still full of greedy men trying to extort money. They say that it is for God’s kingdom, but in reality, they are building their own kingdom.
19And when even was come, he went out of the city. 20And in the morning, as they passed by, they saw the fig tree dried up from the roots.
Luke 13:6–9
6He spake also this parable; A certain man had a fig tree planted in his vineyard; and he came and sought fruit thereon, and found none. 7Then said he unto the dresser of his vineyard, Behold, these three years I come seeking fruit on this fig tree, and find none: cut it down; why cumbereth it the ground? 8And he answering said unto him, Lord, let it alone this year also, till I shall dig about it, and dung it: 9And if it bear fruit, well: and if not, then after that thou shalt cut it down.
Notice that in the above verse, “A certain man had a fig tree planted in his vineyard;”
John 15:1-6
1I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman. 2Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit. 3Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you. 4Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me. 5I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing. 6If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned. 7If ye abide in me, and my words abide in you, ye shall ask what ye will, and it shall be done unto you. 8Herein is my Father glorified, that ye bear much fruit; so shall ye be my disciples.
It is a vine that our Lord selects to show the spiritual union that subsists between himself and his members (the true church). The rebellious people of Israel are compared to “wild grapes,” “an empty vine,” “the degenerate plant of a strange vine,” etc. Isa. 5:2, 4; Jer. 2:21; Hos. 10:1.
I believe that in these verses, it is a fig tree that our Lord selects to show the union that subsists between Himself and the religious order of the day (priests, pastors, etc).
In the book of Genesis God told Adam and Eve, “17But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die“. When Adam and Eve became sin conscious it was fig leaves that they used to cover their nakedness.
Today (and in Yahu’shuas day), there are men using the priesthood to cover their nakedness.
Matthew 23:13-33
13But woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye shut up the kingdom of heaven against men: for ye neither go in yourselves, neither suffer ye them that are entering to go in. 14Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye devour widows’ houses, and for a pretence make long prayer: therefore ye shall receive the greater damnation. 15Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye compass sea and land to make one proselyte, and when he is made, ye make him twofold more the child of hell than yourselves. 16Woe unto you, ye blind guides, which say, Whosoever shall swear by the temple, it is nothing; but whosoever shall swear by the gold of the temple, he is a debtor! 17Ye fools and blind: for whether is greater, the gold, or the temple that sanctifieth the gold? 18And, Whosoever shall swear by the altar, it is nothing; but whosoever sweareth by the gift that is upon it, he is guilty. 19Ye fools and blind: for whether is greater, the gift, or the altar that sanctifieth the gift? 20Whoso therefore shall swear by the altar, sweareth by it, and by all things thereon. 21And whoso shall swear by the temple, sweareth by it, and by him that dwelleth therein. 22And he that shall swear by heaven, sweareth by the throne of God, and by him that sitteth thereon. 23Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone. 24Ye blind guides, which strain at a gnat, and swallow a camel. 25Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye make clean the outside of the cup and of the platter, but within they are full of extortion and excess. 26Thou blind Pharisee, cleanse first that which is within the cup and platter, that the outside of them may be clean also. 27Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye are like unto whited sepulchres, which indeed appear beautiful outward, but are within full of dead men’s bones, and of all uncleanness. 28Even so ye also outwardly appear righteous unto men, but within ye are full of hypocrisy and iniquity. 29Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! because ye build the tombs of the prophets, and garnish the sepulchres of the righteous, 30And say, If we had been in the days of our fathers, we would not have been partakers with them in the blood of the prophets. 31Wherefore ye be witnesses unto yourselves, that ye are the children of them which killed the prophets. 32Fill ye up then the measure of your fathers. 33Ye serpents, ye generation of vipers, how can ye escape the damnation of hell?
Just as Adam and Eve covered their nakedness with fig leaves, men try to cover their spiritual nakedness with religion.
Notice what the priests eyes are on:
verse 14: widows houses
verse 16: the gold of the temple
verse 18: the gift upon the altar
verse 23: tithes
verse 25: extortion and excess
All these things they lust after, and they do it in the name of God.
Yahu’shua says to these men “and for a pretence (outward showing: – cloak) you make long prayers:” They disguise their lust and greed, hiding behind their fig leaf of religion.
In the Strongs Exhaustive Concordance of the Bible, the word hypocrite infers “an actor under an assumed character, a stage player”. Jesus never used that word in reference to any of His disciples; He did however use it repeatedly in reference to the scribes and Pharisees.
The lord says that because they are using God, and His kingdom to satisfy their own lusts, “therefore ye shall receive the greater damnation” (v 14)
1My brethren, be not many masters (teachers), knowing that we shall receive the greater condemnation (James 3:1). My prayer today is that if the Lord were to make reference to you, He would not refer to you as a hypocrite, but as a genuine seeker, and doer, of the truth.
Luke 3:9-14
9And now also the axe is laid unto the root of the trees: every tree therefore which bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire. 10And the people asked him, saying, What shall we do then? 11He answereth and saith unto them, He that hath two coats, let him impart to him that hath none; and he that hath meat, let him do likewise. 12Then came also publicans to be baptized, and said unto him, Master, what shall we do? 13And he said unto them, Exact no more than that which is appointed you. 14And the soldiers likewise demanded of him, saying, And what shall we do? And he said unto them, Do violence to no man, neither accuse any falsely; and be content with your wages.
And now also the axe is laid unto the root of the trees
Now is the point of decision.
Are you a servant of the most high God, or a religious actor following the doctrines of men? Some of you pastors may say, “It is too hard to change“, or “I have a mortgage to pay, I cannot do it”. Still others will call me a raving lunatic, a heretic. But some of you will change your way of thinking, stand up for what is right, and enter yourselves into the beautiful, God inspired, fellowship oriented form of tithing that God ordained.
John 13:35
35By this shall all men know that ye are my disciples, if ye have love one to another.
A Greek transliteration (the original language that the verse was written in) of the word ‘love’ in the above scripture is the word ‘agapē’ which means:
1) affection, good will, love, benevolence, brotherly love
2) love feasts
As you can see… The above scripture (John 13:35) is the full embodiment of the tithing principle
Click here to read The Lords Tithe Part 3
CORRECTIONS:
1. Do not ignore Nehemiah 13:1-9. While Nehemiah was away to Babylon, the high priest, Eliashib, REMOVED the tithes from the TWO STOREROOMS in the Temple and allowed Nehemiah’s Samaritan enemy to move into those vacated rooms.
2. Two storerooms could not possibly hold all of the tithes of the nation. Those rooms only held enough tithes to feed one family of Levites and priests who rotated one week at a time in the Temple and brought what they needed for one week at a time (Mal 3:10).
3. Read Nehemiah 10:37, all of Numbers 35 and all of Joshua 20 and 21 if you dare. The Levites and priests lived in Levitical cities and raised TITHED animals on farmland provided by the other tribes. YES, they did live on farmland and, YES, they did farm and raise herds on that land.
4. The Levites had the tithe as their inheritance. That does not mean that they did not work as farmers and herdsmen on land which they could not inherit or own.
5. Nehemiah 13 is very clear that the PRIESTS had STOLEN the tithe FROM the Levites. The priests had the tithe, not the Levites. They also stole vows from tithes in Malachi 1:13-14 and God cursed them for it.
6. The tithe of Nehemiah 13:10-22 was an emergency RESTOCKING of what the priests had stolen. As in 2nd Chronicles 31:15-19 Levites were appointed to be in charge of distributing the tithes in the Levitical cities.
Russell Earl Kelly, PHD
http://www.tithing-russkelly.com
Russell Earl Kelly, PHD:
I don’t really understand why you wrote in big bold capital letters at the top of your comment CORRECTIONS. You didn’t CORRECT anything.
But I will address your ‘CORRECTIONS’ anyway:
1. Eliashib, DID NOT REMOVE the tithes from the TWO STOREROOMS in the Temple and allow Nehemiah’s Samaritan enemy to move into those vacated rooms. It was 1 room. (Read Nehemiah 13:5)
2. In a signed and sealed document one tenth of the tithe was ordained to be taken to the temple storehouse by the Levites (read Nehemiah 10:38)
3. I read the scriptures that you dared me to read. While I found nothing scary in there I did find it very interesting to learn about the Levitical cities and the farmland. Thank you.
4. as per 3.
5. I can’t see how it is “very clear that the PRIESTS had STOLEN the tithe FROM the Levites” in Nehemiah 13. Nehemiah reprimanded the officials who were not fulfilling their posts. Can you please show me the verse that is “very clear that the PRIESTS had STOLEN the tithe FROM the Levites”.
6. “11So I reprimanded the officials and said, “Why is the house of God forsaken?” Then I gathered them together and restored them to their posts”. The tithe of Nehemiah 13:10-22 was NOT an emergency RESTOCKING of what the priests had stolen. The officials had neglected their duty. Nehemiah told the officials to get back to work and do their job properly.
As much as I know that the priests are prone to thievery I will not falsly accuse them. That would make me no better than them wouldn’t it…
1. “The Levites had the tithe as their inheritance so that they wouldn’t have to work in the field.”
CORRECTION: The above statement is wrong. The Levites and priests both worked in their “loaned” fields 23 of 24 weeks when they were not serving in the temple. They raised tithed animals and had to feel them in their fields from what they grew as farmers.
2. “So he went to the rulers to contend with them.”
CONTEXT: The high priest, Eliashib, was primarily responsible for making sure that the Levites had tithe-food to eat. Notice that the text does not say that the priests had gone back to their fields. The priests had tithe-food to eat because they were the one who emptied the storerooms under Eliashib’s commands. The general population had no access to these rooms. The other rulers were secondarily responsible because they allowed the temple to shut down because of Eliashib’s sin of removing the tithes.
3. I don’t know where the tithe was but when Nehemiah had set things right, the verse tells us “he set treasurers over the treasury“. Then he prays and says, “Lord, remember this one thing, that I have done”.
CORRECTION: The tithe went wherever the priest had stored it after removing it from the temple storeroom.
4. You didn’t CORRECT anything.
Reply: ????
5. (1) Read the rest of Nehemiah and about most commentaries. They turned two small chambers into one great chamber (see 13:9).
6. (2) In a signed and sealed document one tenth of the tithe was ordained to be
taken to the temple storehouse by the Levites (read Nehemiah 10:38).
CORRECTION: Not all at once. Each priest brought it up when he went up to serve. They brought the “portions” they needed (12:44, 47). The wives, daughters and younger sons of those serving needed food plus the whole families of the other 23 familes of priests. If they brought ALL of their tithe to the Temple then the other 98% who were still in the Levitical cities would have nothing to eat!
7. (3) I read the scriptures that you dared me to read.
REPLY: Thank you for at least trying.
8. (5) I can’t see how it is “very clear that the PRIESTS had STOLEN the tithe FROM
the Levites” in Nehemiah 13.
CONTEXT, CONTEXT, CONTEXT: First, the high priest must have been involved in the removal of the tithes. Second, only the Levites lacked tithes. Third, the priests evidently still had their share of tithes. Fourth, read Numbers 18:25-29 and Malachi 1:13-14. Priests were not required to tithe but they were expected to give freewill vow offerings from what they received as tithes. They had stolen from God by swapping sick animals for the good animals they had vowed to give to God.
9. (6) Nehemiah 13:10-22 was NOT an emergency RESTOCKING of what the priests
had stolen.
CONTEXT, CONTEXT, CONTEXT: In Nehemiah 10:37b the ordinary people were commanded to bring their first whole Levitical tithes —not to the Temple— but to the Levitical cities. Therefore 13:10-22 is either an error (God forbid) or an exception to 10:37b.
Russell:
You are majoring on minors and missing the whole point to my original post.
In your efforts to prove yourself the number 1 authority on tithing you are leading me to assume that you are just another Pauline christian trying to promote himself and his ministry.
You are picking on ridiculous little points that really have no relevance whatsoever to the overall context of the message.
Your point 1. You boldly declared that I was wrong with a big bold ‘CORRECTION’ when I stated that “The Levites had the tithe as their inheritance so that they wouldn’t have to work in the field.”
CONTEXT, CONTEXT, CONTEXT, As you would say:
Nehemiah himself says:
10 And I perceived that the portions of the Levites had not been given them; so that the Levites and the singers, that did the work, were fled every one to his field.
11 Then contended I with the rulers, and said: ‘Why is the house of God forsaken?’ And I gathered them together, and set them in their place.
What does Nehemiah say??? “He saw that the Levites and the singers that did the work had fled to their fields”
Why had they fled to their fields??? Because “the portions of the Levites had not been given them”.
Why was the portions of the Levites supposed to have been given them??? “So that they wouldn’t have to work in the field, but could devote themselves wholy to God”.
What did I state that you are so adamant was wrong???
“He saw that the Levites and the singers, that did the work in the house of God were out working in the field (the Levites had the tithe as their inheritance so that they wouldn’t have to work in the field, but could devote themselves wholy to God)”. Was I wrong??? Did my statement need CORRECTION from you???
No… Think about it russell… If the Levites and the singers that did the work in the house of God had been given the portions of the Levites they would not have been out working in their fields would they… the Levites had the tithe (the portions of the Levites) as their inheritance so that they wouldn’t have to work in the field, but could devote themselves wholy to God…!
Perhaps I should have originally added in there “during the time of their service” for your benefit (I didn’t see the need as I was directly referring to what Nehemiah had written).
Your point 2. You are not correcting me… you are correcting Nehemiah Or the bible translators, Ididn’t make the following statement:
“So he went to the rulers to contend with them.” … ???
Perhaps you could share with Nehemiah your “CORRECTIONS” at a later date. That has nothing to do with me.
Your point 3. I wrote: “I don’t know where the tithe was but when Nehemiah had set things right, the verse tells us “he set treasurers over the treasury“. Then he prays and says, “Lord, remember this one thing, that I have done”.
You corrected ?? me with “CORRECTION: The tithe went wherever the priest had stored it after removing it from the temple storeroom.”
WHAT???
And where was that Russell???
I’m sorry Russell… but I still “don’t know where the tithe was”.
Are you just being hard to get along with here???
Here… Let me rephrase my original statement for your benefit:
“I don’t know where the tithe was (and I don’t care, because it doesn’t really matter) but when Nehemiah had set things right, the verse tells us that after he set treasurers over the treasury (here comes the important part) Then he prays and says, “14Remember me, O my God, concerning this, and wipe not out my good deeds that I have done for the house of my God, and for the offices thereof”.
Your point 4. What…?
Your point 5. So what…
Your point 6. In your point 2 of your first comment you stated:
“Two storerooms could not possibly hold all of the tithes of the nation.”
I agreed with you by adding “In a signed and sealed document one tenth of the tithe was ordained to be taken to the temple storehouse by the Levites”.
Yet you found that you still had to “CORRECTION:” me.
How ridiculous…
Your point 7. I stated: “I read the scriptures that you dared me to read”.
Your REPLY: Thank you for at least trying
how condescending of you… (and very Pauline – I notice that a lot of Pauline Christians have a venemous superior attitude).
Your points 8,9. Purely speculation on your part. If the priests had “stolen” the tithe then Nehemiah would have addressed the situation as just that. Nehemiah made no mention of theft. I don’t think that Nehemiah pulled any punches do you??? I am sure that if the priests were stealing Nehemiah would have rebuked the priests rather than the officials:
“11 So I rebuked the officials and asked them, “Why is the house of God neglected?” Then I called them together and stationed them at their posts.”
RUSSELL:
This is a place for sharing knowledge and encouraging others to find the truth. It is not a place for self promotion. Condescending attitudes are not welcome here.
Most of the visitors to this website have had enough of the lying, money hungry, condescending attitudes in the church and have stumbled accross this website in their search for the truth. As far as I am concerned this website is a sacred tool that has been set aside for the glory of our heavenly Father and for the benefit of those who are truly seeking Him. At the end of my days I will look at this website and pray… “14Remember me, O my God, concerning this, and wipe not out my good deeds that I have done for the house of my God, and for the offices thereof”.
The reason that I approved your first comments and allowed a link to your website was because (after spending some hours at your website) I thought that it had some good information for those who are struggling with the tithing message of the church. While I don’t agree with everything on your website… you do have more truth there than the church does and you have definitely taken the time to do some genuine research. Please feel free to share your knowledge with us, but try to do it in a less abrasive manner.
I appreciate the effort that you have put in to discovering the truth about the tithe, and I appreciate your willingness to share it with others. Our view of tithing is not much different in many aspects. Wouldn’t it be better for us to encourage each other??
“As far as I am concerned this website is a sacred tool that has been set aside for the glory of our heavenly Father and for the benefit of those who are truly seeking Him. At the end of my days I will look at this website and pray… “14Remember me, O my God, concerning this, and wipe not out my good deeds that I have done for the house of my God, and for the offices thereof”.”
I pray God blesses you in the present day, as well as at the end … your works will go with you. Be assured that you have practiced true religion in that you have offered comfort to the widow and fatherless … some of us fall into both those categories and your work is truly a blessing. May it come back on you multiplied.
Regarding tithes, I have no PHD or great wisdom, but I look to God’s wise Words through His mouthpieces for some clarity. Jesus agreed with tithing Mt 23:23, Lk 11:42 so I embrace tithing as promoted by Jesus to ‘not leave the other undone’, but I cannot justify giving tithes to lying promoters of lawlessness, so other avenues must be sought regarding who God said to share tithes with and the result is joyful eg Deut 14:29, 16:11 &14, 26:12 & 13. There are many poor strangers crying for aid and there is also a small handfull of Godly priests who promote God’s Laws and feasts, so when Karaites invite donations to aid in seeking evidence for abib, that also would seem to be a justifiable way of supporting God’s Laws. Tithing is supposed to be righteous and joyful and certainly can be. May God be praised for granting opportunities which gladden us and enable us to happily do what is right, rather than furthering corruption.
God bless
Another important aspect of tithes is that they are associated with one of the specific ‘for ever’ scriptural feasts (rather than being gifts associated with other feasts or the usual loving freewill offerings and charity at every opportunity etc)
LEV 23:41 And ye shall keep it a feast unto the LORD seven days in the year. It shall be a statute for ever in your generations: ye shall celebrate it in the seventh month.
DEUT 16:16 Three times in a year shall all thy males appear before the LORD thy God in the place which he shall choose; in the feast of unleavened bread, and in the feast of weeks, and in the feast of tabernacles: and they shall not appear before the LORD empty:
NUM 29:39 These things ye shall do unto the LORD in your set feasts, beside your vows, and your freewill offerings, for your burnt offerings, and for your meat offerings, and for your drink offerings, and for your peace offerings.
Jesus clarified who to share feasts with: LK 14:13 But when thou makest a feast, call the poor, the maimed, the lame, the blind:
Since Jesus rightly shared with the poor at the feasts, nobody suspected the other topic that Jesus discussed with Judas
JN 13:29 For some of them thought, because Judas had the bag, that Jesus had said unto him, Buy those things that we have need of against the feast; or, that he should give something to the poor.
Tithing is a wonderful law, but is not the only law of giving. All the Law is love for God and man (Mt 22:40) and is eternal, as God and His Word and love should be appreciated as being. IS 8:20 To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.
Tithing is a loving eternal law, to be enjoyed by all who share in it, including ourselves. It is a celebration of God’s goodness. It is holy ie ‘set apart’, and is not to be used for corrupt purposes (Deut 26:14).
Glenda,
You have been a blessing to me and everyone who visits this site since you first started posting here. I thank you for taking the time to share your insight and wisdom with us.
You are right… Tithing is a wonderful law. And when we tithe in the correct scriptural manner according to the law, it has the potential to bring great joy to all involved.
As you said… The tithe IS all about love and fellowship.
It has nothing to do with giving 10% of your income before tax as those thieving Pauline preachers are propagating.
Matthew 23:4
“They tie up heavy burdens and lay them on men’s shoulders, but they themselves are unwilling to move them with so much as a finger.
Scriptural tithing is all about affection, good will, love, benevolence, brotherly love… not money.
Here is something VERY interesting that I found!
In the ‘New Testament’ the word ‘agapē’ (love) has that exact meaning;
1) affection, good will, love, benevolence, brotherly love
2) love feasts
Concordance
It adds new meaning to a lot of the scriptures about agapē ‘love’.
John 13:35
“By this all men will know that you are My disciples, if you have love for one another.”
By this all men will know that you are My disciples, if you have affection, good will, love, benevolence, brotherly love, love feasts for one another.
Luke 11:42
“But woe to you Pharisees! For you pay tithe of mint and rue and every kind of garden herb, and yet disregard justice and the love of God; but these are the things you should have done without neglecting the others.
and yet disregard justice and the affection, good will, love, benevolence, brotherly love, love feasts of God
Matthew 24:12-14
“Because lawlessness is increased, most people’s love will grow cold.
Because lawlessness is increased, most people’s affection, good will, love, benevolence, brotherly love, love feasts will grow cold
13″But the one who endures to the end, he will be saved.
14″This gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in the whole world as a testimony to all the nations, and then the end will come.
Lawlessness is increased by the lying Pauline doctrine. The Law is only a burden for those who desire to be lawless. For those who desire to please YHVH the Law is a guiding light. The tithe has been changed from a love feast to a heavy burden by the money hungry liars.
I believe that today our Heavenly Father is calling His children out of the harlot christian churches. I believe He is wanting to establish a new church. Not church in a building that was built by men with the money that should have been used to help the poor, the sick, the widows and the orphans. Not church with a preacher at the pulpit telling the congregation what to believe and that they should give 10 percent of their money to him and if they don’t they are stealing from God. I believe that YHVH will establish a church that has nothing to do with money and nothing to do with Paul. I believe that this church will have everything to do with tithing food and fellowship, with affection, good will, love, benevolence, brotherly love, love feasts for one another and the TRUE teachings of YAHU’SHUA HA MASHIACH.
I imagine a time when followers of ‘The Way’ (as the original disciples were called) will come together regularly for feasts and festivities, for caring and sharing, in thankfulness for the provision that our heavenly Father has blessed us with. A time when the poor and the rich will bring a blessing of food to the table for all to share and all will remember how good YHVH has been and is to us. That through these love feasts (or tithes) a bond will be formed between genuine people who are desiring to be pleasing in our Fathers sight.
John 17:20-23
20″I do not ask on behalf of these alone, but for those also who believe in Me through their word;
21that they may all be one; even as You, Father, are in Me and I in You, that they also may be in Us, so that the world may believe that You sent Me.
22″The glory which You have given Me I have given to them, that they may be one, just as We are one;
23I in them and You in Me, that they may be perfected in unity, so that the world may know that You sent Me, and loved them, even as You have loved Me.
(Loved in verse 23 means: to welcome, to entertain, to be fond of, to love dearly) Notice Yahu’shua states in verse 21 “so that the world may believe that You sent Me” and then He repeats Himself or reinforces the fact in verse 23 “so that the world may know that You sent Me”.
By this all men will know that you are My disciples, if you have affection, good will, love, benevolence, brotherly love, love feasts for one another.
Agapē love involves food. It involves affection, good will, love, benevolence, brotherly love… And food shared in loving fellowship.
It is my hope that through this website people will be encouraged to become followers of “The Way” that Yahu’shua lived and preached. That friendships will be formed and that a congregation will be established according to the will of the Father.
Deuteronomy 12:5-8
5″But you shall seek the YHVH at the place which YHVH your God will choose from all your tribes, to establish His name there for His dwelling, and there you shall come.
6″There you shall bring your burnt offerings, your sacrifices, your tithes, the contribution of your hand, your votive offerings, your freewill offerings, and the firstborn of your herd and of your flock.
7″There also you and your households shall eat before YHVH your God, and rejoice in all your undertakings in which YHVH your God has blessed you.
8″You shall not do at all what we are doing here today, every man doing whatever is right in his own eyes;
(verse 7″There also you and your households shall eat before the LORD your God, and rejoice in all your undertakings in which YHVH your God has blessed you.)
Deuteronomy 12:18
“But you shall eat them before YHVH your God in the place which YHVH your God will choose, you and your son and daughter, and your male and female servants, and the Levite who is within your gates; and you shall rejoice before YHVH your God in all your undertakings.
What a wonderful time of fellowship that would be.
YHVH bless you, and keep you;
YHVH make His face shine on you,
And be gracious to you;
YHVH lift up His countenance on you,
And give you peace
I’m surprised that I could be considered a blessing by anyone, and I think such consideration reflects more on your merciful attitude than on me. Your words are the answer to your prayer for me … God being gracious and shining His face on me. God uses people to do His Will. You have been used accordingly. Thanking God and you for the comforting healing such blessing brings.
Thank you immensely for studying and sharing the meaning of agape to include love feasts, which expands the word way beyond what I was aware of. It is even more beautiful than I had previously realised and the verses you used as examples highlight this.
“I believe that YHVH will establish a church that has nothing to do with money and nothing to do with Paul. I believe that this church will have everything to do with tithing food and fellowship, with affection, good will, love, benevolence, brotherly love, love feasts for one another and the TRUE teachings of YAHU’SHUA HA MASHIACH.”
Agreement/unity.
God produces good food, both physical and spiritual. You have already brought one sort of food to the table and shared … living bread. You have included widows in the feast. I needed this more than bakery produce. Thank you.
As an aside, money is interesting. God in scripture does discuss beneficial uses of money eg as a trading utility for food or life etc and Jesus discussed when to take a purse, so maybe the issue could involve service? … whether money serves the person or instead whether a person serves money (like any idol eg people must serve loved ornaments by dusting them etc, while an ornament doesn’t love and does nothing useful to serve a person)? Can’t serve 2 masters. When people worship money, they seem to focus on accumulating it and work themselves to death to do so. No rest. Another aspect is ‘render to Caesar what has his image and render to God what is His’ … and that’s not a copy of any worshipped Roman icon (could include Paul maybe?)
“Lawlessness is increased by the lying Pauline doctrine. The Law is only a burden for those who desire to be lawless. For those who desire to please YHVH the Law is a guiding light. ”
TRUTH!
There is much hope though, because I was a blind lawless snake-bitten Paulist and was brought to repentance and healing by looking to Yeshua/Jesus. May others also be healed. We need to bring our sick for healing and often this equates to loving enemies who hurt us. It’s what Jesus prayed for his tormentors. Sadly I often find this very difficult … but not impossible. May I become more like our Master with much more ready grace.
“It is my hope that through this website people will be encouraged to become followers of “The Way” that Yahu’shua lived and preached. That friendships will be formed and that a congregation will be established according to the will of the Father.”
I hope the same. May God’s Will be done in this. May He be pleased to establish His Name here. I’ll share in prayer accordingly in the Son’s name.
MT 18:20 For where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them.
JN 14:13 And whatsoever ye shall ask in my name, that will I do, that the Father may be glorified in the Son:14 If ye shall ask any thing in my name, I will do it.
MK 11:24 Therefore I say unto you, What things soever ye desire, when ye pray, believe that ye receive them, and ye shall have them.
peace, blessings and gratitide to you …
YHVH bless you, and keep you;
YHVH make His face shine on you,
And be gracious to you;
YHVH lift up His countenance on you,
And give you peace
If tithes is 10%,When Abraham gave tithes,He was giving material things,so how do calculate tihes if you don’t have money.
If i have 9 cows,what is the 10% of those cows
phumlani:
If you only have 9 animals in your flock or herd then scripturally you are not required to tithe of it.
Leviticus 27:32
And concerning the tithe of the herd, or of the flock, even of whatsoever passeth under the rod, the tenth shall be holy unto YHVH.
If you run your herd of cows through a crush and count them under a rod and count only 9 cows, because the tenth shall be holy unto YHVH, you do not qualify to tithe. If you have 11 cows, when you run them through a crush and under the rod which ever one is the tenth one under the rod shall be holy unto YHVH (i.e. your tithe).
The Lord does however ask for the the first offspring of every beast that you own.
Exodus 13:12
you shall devote to the LORD the first offspring of every womb, and the first offspring of every beast that you own; the males belong to YHVH.
Tithing is all about sharing. In the modern church, tithing should be all about feeding the poor, the widows and the orphans.
Our Heavenly Father did not ordain the tithe to be a burden on the poor, but a blessing for them.
There is much, much more to scriptural tithing than the 10% rule spouted by the modern church. Most of the ministers who preach tithing and line their pockets with the proceeds thereof have no right to the God ordained tithe whatsoever.
The God ordained tithe is a love (agapē) feast.
There are alot of people who have turned from God because of the love of money. The bible itself teaches that the love of money is the root of all evil. It is true that most tv preachers are seeking to make merchandise of us through covetousness, not following the true and living God, but mammon. We cannot serve God and mammon.